| xyb
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I must commend all of you here on not sinking to the depths of those who have sent hate mail. Left unchecked, such vile expressions lead us to some pretty scary places.
I’d like to point out something that has become commonplace in the world of blogging, something that Pink Truth is also enduring.
Women are increasingly becoming targets of hate mail, hate messages and sexually based death threats. It has matured mostly in arenas where men have classically dominated (computer-based fields, like web development and computer science). I’ll start with the most extreme case, that of Kathy Sierra. If you have the stomach, view her blog here: http://headrush.typepad.com/creating_passionate_users/. She has moved the most vile stuff off the main page, so you don’t have to be subjected to it in order to get the point.
Yes, it is assumed that these messages were written/crafted by men. But, how can we as women continue sucking up this kind of abuse? Especially when it is wielded at us by our own gender! Fast-forward five years, and the hate mail could very well turn into this kind of vile hatred. And what happens when a Mary Kay husband snaps?
This is not a single example of hatred being spewed at women online. Check out this report by The Guardian: http://technology.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,,2051580,00.html
Even Salon reported on Kathy Sierra… http://www.salon.com/mwt/broadsheet/2007/03/28/kathy_sierra/index.html, supported by Robert Scoble.
When Mary Kay consultants and directors spew such hatred on a message board or in email, they are only laying the groundwork for de-sensitizing society to the vile stuff that turns into death threats and worse. They have to stop this, now.
Come to the table, supporters of Mary Kay Cosmetics, and *discuss* the points on which you think we are wrong. Don’t go against your very charter and dehumanize ANY woman, friend or foe. |
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| mrsmetaphor
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XYB:
You’re right…very disturbing indeed and something that needs to be exposed. I know that Tracy gets much worse hatemail than she posts here and has taken a GREAT DEAL of personal attack for her work here. It means so much when people stand behind this site and behind her as a person when attack comes and we pray that it never escalates to the horrific level that Kathy had to endure. |
An an expansive beach, a slighty odd piece of sandglass…
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| Happy2BeMe
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 That was appalling! I cannot even imagine writing a THREATNING e-mail or letter to someone. I truly can’t; and I consider myself pretty outspoken….but to threaten in such an inhumane manner?
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Ebay consigner – please PM or e-mail sicknpink@hotmail.com
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| xyb
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Mrs. Metaphor, that’s why I posted this. I’m seriously concerned with the “slippery slope” (sorry for using the over-used) of what “hate mail” is becoming.
I know Tracy receives much worse, and that’s what I’m worried about. I know *Tracy* can handle it, because she’s tough. But with no one else calling them out, this type of verbal abuse becomes “normal.” And that just can’t happen.
So, while Tracy sucks it up (because she can’t stoop that low to respond), we must step in for the good of all women.
SickNPink, I’m so glad to hear that. I might have called someone “ugly” for acting this way, but I certainly believe that those that abuse are seriously in the minority.
Still, we must back each other up. Thanks for speaking up. |
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| Kat
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That was appalling! I cannot even imagine writing a THREATNING e-mail or letter to someone. I truly can’t; and I consider myself pretty outspoken….but to threaten in such an inhumane manner?
Sickie~~~~I bet if given enough time QJ could go over that line too  |
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| ChaosTamer
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If you look at the way the world is going it is sad to see all the decay in respect and self control. Debate is good when balanced sides are presented. Some people that send hate mail truely believe what they are “saying” is true and the people they attack are evil. Fundamental respect for each other as a fellow human does not exist widespread. It seems that more and more there are splinter groups for everything, all hating the others for not being one of their group. Society is becoming a materialistic, me me me mentality. When I read the hate mail posts from people who claim a religious code make me stop and think. What in the world is happening to us? Why are people becoming so selfish and hateful? Today’s shootings at Virginia Tech is one more example of someone with so much hate that those who were not even known to the killer died, and for what reason?
Maybe if we did not post the hate mail that would stop the “pot stirring” and end it. But human nature does not allow that action to be successful. PT stills gets the emails and sees the ugliness. There are ways to trace emails, but it is time consuming and expensive and the offender can jump faster than we can track.
So, I live each day trying to treat each person that crosses my path with respect and dignity. You never know who they are or when they may cross your path again. If I treat people with respect then I do not worry about looking over my shoulder to see if anyone is after me. If I am a victim of random violence, my family at least knows I did nothing to offend.
Hatred has and always be a part of this world. Many have tried to be peacemakers. But the peace never lasts. All we can do is try to make our paths peaceful.
I hope my ramblings make sense and cause one to pause and think. |
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| xyb
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ChaosTamer: I’m going to say this, but please understand that its’ from a perspective of *totally* agreeing with you: What do you mean, ‘becoming materialistic’?? We’ve been that way for a very long time, and it’s only getting worse!! *sigh* So, you and I are on the same page.
I agree that *not* posting the hate mail won’t solve a thing. In fact, exposing this kind of hatred/borderline violence/verbal abuse will help to raise awareness of what we are doing to each other. Hopefully it will give everyone pause, causing them to step back and rethink that next response.
I’m sure the text of any given hate mail made sense at the time. And some of it still makes sense to the sender, given their perspective. That’s why it is HEALTHY to change your perspective, and look at it from another person’s point of view. Anything. I don’t care what the opinion is, it’s always good to sanity-check yourself. Check your attitudes. Have they slipped down a bad path? If not, your check will verify your position.
The difference with a healthy sanity check and an unhealthy one is what/who you check it against. When you take one of these seething emails and bump it up against any other aspect of society as a whole (except for some extreme religious beliefs, which seem to agree), you get a bad result. Comparing the Kathy Sierra emails with some of these consultant emails results in eerie similarities.
While the strength of the web is in exposing ourselves to many varying opinions and positions, the down-side is that of anonymity.
All I ask these hate-mail senders is to accept feedback from others who are trying to tell them that they are being abusive. Just like a battering spouse… you never want to admit you’re wrong, but you are. Hurtful and wrong. |
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| Happy2BeMe
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Chaos Tamer…you truly do have a special gift for giving people back their dignity. It’s a VERY SPECIAL gift and you use it very wisely.
Sometimes it is hard to understand when someone’s gifting is not our own (i.e. Sickie says– WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU HAVEN’T EVEN STARTED THE PAPERWORK for your TAXES due today!!!!)…………
What is great about PT (unlike MK) is that we are not only allowed by encouraged to be ourselves….NOW that being said, I can say I have learned SO MUCH from all of you.
There are days I wish I handled myself better and there are days I think…..awwwww screw it! |
Ebay consigner – please PM or e-mail sicknpink@hotmail.com
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| Happy2BeMe
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WELL DANG IT! I hit the enter key too fast…….then tried to modify and it must have taken me more than 2 minutes….grrrrr
….sometimes finding ourselves again after being in cult for so long brings out the extremes until we can gain a balance….
However, sending THREATENING YOUR LIFE hatemail is simply unnacceptable IMHO. Yes we have freedom of speech, but we also have restraining orders.  |
Ebay consigner – please PM or e-mail sicknpink@hotmail.com
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| marvelous light
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xyb, i went to the links you provided and to say i was stunned would be an understatement … horrified might be a better descriptor. you are absolutely right about our need to be aware of where the hate mail can lead and to be vigilant in confronting it! i’m realizing that PT probably shows us the emails suitable for viewing, i can’t begin to imagine what we don’t see, but she sees every day! i think i’ll be adding PTs protection to my prayers from now on! thank you, xyb, for this post!
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You can’t fix stupid!
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| xyb
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marvelous, I was really struggling with just how much to warn people about the graphic nature of these emails. Unfortunately, they’re becoming much more common. It makes me really sad.
Thanks for your prayers, marvelous! |
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| Jypsi
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I must say that this is unbelievable and heartbreaking. It is truly sad the way the world is imploding in on itself. From religious battles to racial battles to financial battles….on & on & on. The intense violent nature of the threats and comments is unexcusable. This is what happens when there are no real repercussions for violent behavior of even a small degree. Is there a real solution to this? Probably not in this millenium.
It seems to me that Jesus gave everyone the only solution to this hatred and evil…two ‘commandments’ if you will…that can work for any religion at all and if you aren’t spiritual then just follow rule #2:
1) Love the Lord with all your heart, all you mind, and all your soul. (EVERY religion has A God, whether he is called God or Allah or something else, and some even have more than one but even then there is one who is ‘stronger) Note that Jesus did not say “Love ME…He said “Love the LORD”
2) Love thy neighbor as yourself. (for those non-religious/spiritual people this still works)
I know, I know, I am being naive and foolish to even THINK that the world could solve it’s problems this easily…but…could it? See what happens the next time you simply smile at a stranger for no reason. Or help someone move a broke down car out of the road instead of just  as you drive around them. I realize that I still sound like a fool and I apologize if this post bothers anyone. |
 Everyone needs an angel on their side!
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| sick of lies
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The most rediculous part about hate mail is when people don’t even know the person they are writing to. I’ve had little disputes with people on ebay where we emailed each other and tried to understand each other, and we ended up becoming friends or talking about our families… once you try to understand someone or get to know them, you suddenly don’t see them as some evil senseless person you’ve never even met.
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| xyb
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sick of lies, that is fabulous!!! Yes, if we just seek to “go to the other side of the table,” we’ll learn so much about each other. And we will find common ground. It’s that common ground that we can use to repair the conversation and even become friends.
The anonymity of the web obscures the reality that there is a living, breathing person on the receiving end of that hateful message. |
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Banned from the Bitchfest: Pink Truth Can Bite My Ass 
Me said
They obviously have never read some of Tracy’s writings that are hate mail.
Someone named XYB used to have a blog about Mary Kay a long time ago that I saw (over a year ago) but I don’t know who she is.
I think they take themselves WAY too seriously.
PT is Smokin'........Not! said
You know, there are so many ways to be abusive. Tracy seems to have many of them down pat. Short, sarcastic responses to queries; deletion and censoring of posts; making hate mail public and inviting invective on the women and men who send the (mostly) ill-written e-mails that are probably knee jerk responses to crap they’ve read on PT; publishing a contractor’s name and phone number on a blog; and on and on.
Maybe you just have to say the right thing at the right time to be one of Tracy’s 2%.
The Cheese Stands Alone said
Hmmmm…..
This may sound nuts, but I think XYB could be Tracy. Did anyone go to the link provided by XYB in the first post? It’s something about “creating passionate users”. Well, I did and about halfway down the page I found this woman’s, Kathy Sierra’s, tips for running a successful blog and “creating passionate users. Here are some interesting points she mentions……..
(my points are in ALL CAPS)
__________________________________________
User Community and ROI
“Every time I give a talk, someone always asks, “That’s all good and nice that helping users learn is the key to creating passionate users… but who’s going to do all that extra work? Who’s going to make the extra tutorials and better docs?” Answer: your user community. Think about all the things a strong user community can do for you: tech support, user training, marketing (evangelism, word of mouth), third-party add-ons, even new product ideas. And that’s not including any extra sales you might make on community/tribe items like t-shirts, stickers, and other gear.”
***SO SHE’S ADVISING YOU TO USE YOUR PARTICIPANT’S TO CREATE DOCUMENTS, TECH SUPPORT, MARKETING (GETTING THE WORD OUT), ETC. SHE EVEN MENTIONS THE BENEFIT OF EXTRA SALES ON “TRIBE” ITEMS LIKE T-SHIRTS, STICKERS, ETC. SOUND FAMILIAR?
“Yes, there’s still a budget… but we’ve all seen third-party fan/user groups that got no support at all from “the mother ship” and yet thrived and gave users a level of support and training the company didn’t provide. But there’s still that little of issue of getting users involved, and for that–the single biggest factor is getting users involved at a much earlier path on their learning journey than typically happens.”
***SHE”S ADVISING THAT YOU GET THEM INVOLVED IMMEDIATELY (BEOFRE THEY HAVE A CHANCE TO FIGURE OUT YOU’RE NUTS!)
“Today, this post will offer a few more tips on how to use your marketing budget (tiny as it may be) to build, support, and grow a user community from the beginning.”
“* Host some kind of discussion forum (can include chat, wikis, and blogs as well), and do whatever it takes to get people there as soon as possible, ideally while the thing is still in beta (but it’s never too late to start!)”
***PT STARTED AS JUST A BLOG, BUT LATER ROLLED OUT A DISCUSSION BOARD
“* Look on other third-party forums where users are discussing (which usually means struggling) your product, and find the most active people. Reach out to your earliest adopters or strongest new users and offer them non-paid incentives for becoming active. Chances are, if you have any users at all and your product is even the least bit complicated, people are discussing it somewhere. This could be anywhere from Amazon product reviews to technical discussion boards and even comments on related blogs.”
***SEARCH OTHER ANTI-MK SITES AND RECRUIT THE MOST ACTIVE PARTICIPANTS. OFFER THEM INCENTIVES TO PARTICPATE ON YOUR BOARD.
“* Make these folks life-time “charter members” with special privileges and recognition as ‘founders’ that nobody else will ever get.”
****ONE WORD………..”MAVENS”
“* Have levels and rewards for participating (but again, not money–that totally changes the motivation, or at least the perceived motivation). The rewards can simply be status, early access to betas, and especially restricted access to the developers where they can discuss their ideas or at least listen to the engineers and designers describe why they made the choices they did, etc. [Don’t reward people for post quantity alone… if post-count is the only criteria, you end up with a zillion useless posts]. Study successful user group communities for examples (like, say, javaranch.com–3/4 million unique visitors a month).”
****SPECIAL SECRET ACCESS? SOUND FAMILIAR?
“* Teach users how to help other members by creating documents (or getting other users to write them) on how to ask and answer questions in the most productive way.”
****SPREADSHEETS FOR RETURNING INVENTORY AND OTHER DOCUMENTS FOR NEWBIES TO USE THAT WERE CREATED BY THE “FOUNDING MEMBERS”
“* Include some just-for-fun activities in your community, like one (usually ONLY one) totally off-topic forum.”
****CAPTION THAT PHOTO
“* Encourage forum moderators or other community leaders to have their own private discussion space.”
****AGAIN, SUPER-SECRET “MAVENS-ONLY” CHAT ROOMS AND DISCUSSION BOARDS
“* Why not help your top community leaders get a book deal? You never know… if it’s a tech topic, direct them (or yourself) over to Wiley publisher Joe Wikert for some excellent and candid advice (search his archives, and you’ll find everything from how to write a proposal, whether you need an agent, etc.)”
****OH MY GOD!!!!! DOES THAT SAY “WILEY”?????? HMMM…WHO ELSE DO WE KNOW WITH A “BOOK DEAL” WITH WILEY?
“* Create limited-edition, not-for-sale t-shirts, stickers, and other gear JUST for the founding community members (if you’re just getting started in building a community). For ongoing communities, do the same thing and distribute them randomly, for free. Use the principle of “intermittent variable reward” that works so well to make slot machines and twitter so addicting ; )”
“* Make your community leaders or even just active participants HEROES. Create “superhero” Moo cards for them. Plaster their photos everywhere. (Cute story I heard from a reader here — she met her husband online while they were both moderators for an Autodesk CAD forum.)”
****TRACY HAS RAISINBERRY, SUZY Q, SADNPINK, AND OTHERS WRITING ARTICLES AND THE MEMBERS LOVE THEM!
“* Above all, keep teaching members to teach other members. Give everyone a crash course in learning theory. The better they become at helping others–the more skills they develop in mentoring/tutoring others–the more meaningful and motivating it is for them to keep on doing it.”
****WHO WAS IT THAT WAS JUST TEACHING OTHER MEMBERS HOW TO PLACE PT CARDS IN TARGET?
______________________________________________________
Interesting, huh?
The Cheese Stands Alone said
Sorry that was so long. I just thought it was relevant.
Also, notice in XYB’s second post above how she says….
“I know Tracy receives much worse, and that’s what I’m worried about. I know *Tracy* can handle it, because she’s tough. But with no one else calling them out, this type of verbal abuse becomes “normal.” And that just can’t happen.”
****SO SHE’S COMPLIMENTING TRACY (“SHE’S TOUGH”) AND ENCOURAGING
OTHERS TO “CALL THEM OUT”
So, while Tracy sucks it up (because she can’t stoop that low to respond), we must step in for the good of all women.
****AGAIN, COMPLIMENT TRACY (SHE CAN”T STOOP THAT LOW TO RESPOND) AND ENCOURAGE OTHERS TO STEP IN AND DEFEND HER
In her third post XYB says….
“I agree that *not* posting the hate mail won’t solve a thing. In fact, exposing this kind of hatred/borderline violence/verbal abuse will help to raise awareness of what we are doing to each other. Hopefully it will give everyone pause, causing them to step back and rethink that next response.”
****GIVING HERSELF AN EXCUSE FOR POSTING HATEMAIL
Tracy is truly a master manipulator. Don’t think that everything she does isn’t completely orchestrated.
You Ain'T No DaIsY said
These poor saps on PT…can we say “stooges”?
Oh and the book stuff – if you go read on Wiley’s site about her book, you’ll see that the “Essentials” is a series like Cliff Notes. The publisher decides the content and then hires someone to just fill out the template.
TRACY: You’re a crazy LIAR and all of your crap is catching up with you!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Me said
Could this be damage control of Tracy’s part? Knowing there is a mole and putting this out there knowing it will land here and make her look good?
I mean it doesn’t make her look good (thank you, Cheese) but she might think it does…..
Zoe said
LMAO sexually based death threats? Is she fucking kidding? hahahahaha. Yeah, um…okay. Pink Truth detractors are all about that. *gag*
Also, I think this new MAVEN is probably Tracy.
Also PULEASE about dehumanizing women. Give me a freaking break. So women are off limits even to other women? You never hear men get on a message board going…”My own gender has turned against me. The world is a bad, evil place when even other men are dehumanizing men.”
THIS is what I don’t support this victim mentality that our society is trying desperately to put in women. The bottom line is if we want to get to the crux of gender and power, law enforcement issues aside, MOST men have the ability to do physically whatever they want to a woman. But MOST of them don’t. Why? Because most men have a biological urge to PROTECT women, not harm them.
This high level of paranoia and victimhood women are now trying to encourage in each other just pisses me off.
I think rather than engendering this level of paranoia and fear in women acting like the society at large is out to “get us” there should be ways to teach people (not just women) how to spot the few psychos and steer clear. At this point we are getting to the point where women are being treated about like children “Don’t talk to strangers.” As if grown adults cannot be trusted to learn warning signs for crazy behavior and steer clear of that.
Zoe said
Also, there is a great book out there called: “The Gift of Fear” dealing with APPROPRIATE fear responses.
Our society is getting to a point where women are becoming so overstimulated with fear whether it’s appropriate, valid, real or not that when there IS something they should listen to their gut about, they shrug it off as paranoia. IMO this freaking out over internet messages is just the type of thing that overstimulates the fear response and keeps people so afraid that when danger really IS near, they’ve talked themselves out of their fear, because all the other times it was a false alarm. There is only so many times you can cry wolf to yourself before you don’t know how to survive anymore.
CatsRUs said
“there should be ways to teach people (not just women) how to spot the few psychos and steer clear.”…
LOL! YES! The “mission” of Duh’s blog and PTLIES!
Me said
Here is the blog I mentioned earlier: http://xybforpeace.blogspot.com/
Nothing has been posted since April of this year and prior to that it was a long time. But there is discussion of Mary Kay from last year.
You have to wonder what keeps people talking about something for SO LONG after their association with it ends. If this is the same woman, she is no longer discussing it on her own blog, but now apparently has moved over to PT and gotten in Tracy’s good graces by becoming a maven.
Meow Mix said
I would not be surprised if XYB was actually Tracy. I’m sure 95% of the users there are her. LOL
BITCHES!
SillySally said
On another note……..Sickie needs to get over herself and what she thinks she “knows”. Fucking Bitch!!
Duped said
I totally agree with you, Zoe. You have said exactly what I wanted to say. LOL Fuck, much more of this agreeing shit is going to make us sound just like them over there. Quick – someone disagree and cuss a lot. 😛
Zoe said
oh my fucking god duped, you are so lame and transparent.
Did that help?
Have a fake internet donut.
Oops…I just screwed it up there didn’t I?
Zoe said
😛 (just in case I was a REALLY good actress there)
Dana said
Oh, where to start?
I guess on a positive note so I’m not devaluing you women and going against my charter….. (gag). Happy 4th of July! I hope you all had a great holiday!
But back to the post…… I almost choked when I read that people in MK who object to Pinktruth should raise their concerns for open debate, not write hate mail. There is no debating with these illogical, brainwashed pinktruth-bots! Tracy censors anything remotely resembling debate!
And what about the things they write? They don’t just write sunshine and happiness!
Ugg….. what “loosers.”
Boo Boo the FOOL!! said
Since they’re so fuckin’ concerned about hate mail and all, why not post the hate mail that TRACY SENDS OUT?? Then compare the two and see who’s worse. Umm, yeah, that’ll take no time to figure out.
Fuckin’ hypocrite glass house livin’ bitches!
Duped said
Ahhh…much better Zoe! At least fake internet doughnuts don’t make my ass fatter than it already is. God knows I don’t need to run any more than I already do…fuckers.
Anyway, happy 4th of July (belated) to my US friends here – should have said that when I posted. Damnit, I am lame. I know. 😛
As for posting the hate mail Tracy sends out – I am all for that. Let’s compare the two, shall we? I have read some of it, and trust me, I have never seen the “cunt” word used more liberally than I did there. Wowza.
Now, back to finishing my coffee whilst sitting on my fat ass…
LMAO! said
LOL
I’ve got some good hate mail from Tracy – you thought the dirty rotten slut/cunt stuff was stupid –she’s lettin ALL the crazy hang out now.
And Sickie. Oh. MY GAWD. i can’t freaking WAIT for PTLies to start exposing that nutbag.
SillySally said
Copied from PT:
—————————————-
Queen of No-Shows
Maybe our medals can be determined by the size of a paypal donation LOLOL
Sorry Tracy, I know you’re not like that, I just couldn’t resist.
Comment left at 5:35 pm on 2 Jul 2007
——————————————-
These women are PATHETIC!!! They just crave recognition – any kind, from anyone!! At least this one is savvy enough to know that Ms Coenen is only in it for the money (and recognition for herself too). Sad & pathetic IN MK, and OUT of it………..
I’d feel sorry for them but they’re so bitchy and awful that’s it’s beyond me……..tough luck chuck!
Meow Mix said
Gee SS, you sound angry…tell us how you REALLY feel…………???
BITCHES!
Dizzy from the Dastardly ways of Tracy said
Stupid wordpress
Willie Lump Lump said
LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
It’s ok, Dizzy i won’t say anything. 😛
She Who Must Not Be Named said
I am going to follow Tracy’s lead here and use my investigative skills to determine who xyb is *pressing fingers to temples* … humalah humalah hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm…..
OK IT HAS BEEN -CONFIRMED-
that xyb is Tracy. Watch out! She is posting on the ‘bad blog.’
Don’t ask me for IP addresses or any actual proof, because, like I said, I used the Tracy method for confirmation of identity.
My Cat Came Back said
I recalled seeing this link over on MKS a very long time ago and “consumed269” was the one who “owned” this blog according to the following post.
————————————————————–
Finally! An independent opinion!! Message List
Reply | Forward Message #20814 of 46156
Take a look at this comment I got on my blog yesterday:
http://xybforpeace.blogspot.com/2005/11/site-rating-request.html
Then, note his blog. No affiliation with Mary Kay. And, he says we’re
doing nothing wrong!! HAH!
*snoopy dance*
Wed Nov 16, 2005 10:08 am
Show Message Option
——————————————————————————–
View Source
Use Fixed Width Font
Unwrap Lines
——————————————————————————–
“consumed269”
consumed269
Offline
Send Email
Invite to Yahoo! 360°
////////////////////////////////////////////////////
I don’t believe that Tracy was “consumed” , hence, not the owner of the XYB blog.
Her user name was: Christy XXXXXXX (it’s all coming back to me now). Ahh, the good ole days, when it seemed as though everyone got along. Amazing how many of us have such a history, but now, we don’t even seem to remember each other because we’ve all branched off into different names.
Kind of sad isn’t it………
My Bologna Has A First Name said
No one had the same thought as me! I was thinking it was her mommy. Doesn’t it sound like it’s her mom?
Dana said
Quoted from Duh’s May 14th post: Aren’t we glad that PT ladies never say mean things about others? We wouldn’t want people to hurt women, now would we. (For those who didn’t read the May 14th post, these are things they posted about Duh in her karma.
————————————————–
“SICKNPINK- “You are truly a FREAK and I mean that in a BAD way.”
Personal Use Recruiter- “for mocking a mother about her disabled child”
Pink Truth- “Trollness Maximus”
Baroness von Scrub- “Just in case you forgot…You still suck.”
high hopes- “mean little troll”
Dizzy from the Dastardly ways of Tracy said
Nice
XYB strikes again « Banned from the Bitchfest: Pink Truth Can Bite My Ass said
[…] https://somecallmeduh.wordpress.com/2007/07/04/who-is-xyb/ […]